Guest Post: 'Getting In & Knowing Stuff'

This could be you...

Hi all.

As part of the start of a new influx of AdGrads writers, below is an account about how to prepare for interviews by Jen Meyerson Dubbin. Take it away, Jen:

“They aren’t going to expect us to know stuff, right?”

by Jen Meyerson Dubbin

Your blood is pumping. You are hopefully not sweating through your suit. You nervously tap your foot against your leg while sitting on a modern chair that was clearly chosen for design instead of comfort. After having applied to every grad scheme and junior position under the sun, you have landed an interview.

You’re an ad grad who knows their stuff. Your lecturers and professors have prepared you. You brought your portfolio of your previous work to show, and yesterday you reviewed pertinent materials from your lectures to refresh yourself.

You start talking to and sizing up the competition whilst you all wait for a chance to break into Adland. There's someone with a BSc in Biology from Edinburgh, BA in Medieval History from Cambridge, BA in English from Sheffield, and then there's you; an ad grad. When the group finds out you are an ad grad the whole dynamic changes to you versus everyone else. The guy from Cambridge anxiously asks, “They aren’t going to expect us to know stuff, right?” While the girl from Edinburgh reassures him by saying, “They know we aren’t ad people.”

This should be obvious, but make sure you prepare for your interview. When I went on interviews, I was surprised at the number of people who didn’t seem to think they needed to do anything to prepare. Yes, ad agencies do expect you to know about advertising. You aren’t being hired as an account manager or planner for your ability to make a decent cuppa - especially in this economy. There is nothing wrong with never having taken an advertising course, but that’s not a valid excuse to not know about advertising. You wouldn’t expect a lorry driver not to know how to operate a vehicle. No-one expects you to know everything and it's okay to be wrong. However, it’s essential to have an opinion - make sure you're more knowledgeable than a general consumer. 

There are several things you can do to prepare for an advertising interview. It might take a bit of work to get there, but knowledge is empowering and a confidence booster too. Obviously, I can’t cover everything in this post - those who've gotten in, please feel free to post additional recommendations in the comment section.

Knowing how an advertising concept works and having knowledge of a little bit of history is essential; especially if there is a team task involved in the interview process. Sometimes you will be lucky by being informed before the interview the type of task you will be given. Use that information to focus your preparation - for instance, I was in a team where one of members was trying to explain to the team that the target market should be as broad as possible when it should actually be narrow and specific to be optimally targeted. He obviously didn’t do his prep work and it hurt the team. In these situations, you don’t want to be the weak link in your group.

What's more, you should try to find out what the person in the position you are applying for does. There are a lot of websites and blogs that should have the information available (Linkedin, for example). If you can’t find anything, note that some agencies do have quirky job titles, so be sure to ask in the interview. Use what you learned to sell yourself by connecting your skills and experience to the position - most things you've done can be related to advertising in some way - you've just got to know what the job entails.

When it comes to research, look at the agency you are applying to online. You can learn about their agency culture, clients, current & past work, people, and history. You can also find information in trade publications and websites such as (e.g., IPA, Brand Republic).

Learn about other agencies. Agencies are brands with communication products just like Coca-Cola is a brand with soft drink products. Other agencies are the competitors of the agency you are applying for. You don’t need to do SWOT analyses for each, but basics like what they offer, who their current & past clients are, current & past work, and agency culture should have you well covered. In the end, you should be able to talk about what differentiates Agency A from Agency B.

Finally, when I set off in advertising school I thought Planners & Account Managers went to college and Creatives went to portfolio school, but the ad world isn’t like that. There are no extra points for having a communications and business background. No specific mold of what makes an ad person exists. 

Advertising is incredibly diverse. Some people have degrees while others don’t. Those who do have degrees come from a variety of disciplines. Regardless of their discipline, ad people are willing to put in the work to stay current and knowledgeable because they genuinely like what they do.

Ad Agency Grad Schemes - 2011/12...

Some of these folks may end up working in adland....

Hi all.

This is (probably) the post you've been waiting for, if you're a regular reader of the site. The list of ad agencies that are running graduate schemes in the second half of 2011 are below. I'm sure I've missed one or two - do let me know in the comments:

AMV:

Shortly to open in October 2011 (here). You can keep an eye on the latest comings and goings by following their twitter account.

BBH:

BBH have no ‘formal’ graduate scheme running at the moment; instead, they have two initiatives – one of which is a ten week internship (the twitter’s here), though it appears the deadline’s past (and I’m unclear about whether it is US only or UK and US – does anyone from BBH London want to comment?), and another which is a formalised placement scheme. Check them out.

BMB:

BMB are running a ‘non grad grad scheme’, which is shortly to open. Whether you have a degree or not, you can apply. Keep an eye on it – it reportedly opens on the 1^st of November.

CHI:

CHI’s grad scheme is due to open in December 2011. Watch this page like a hawk, as well as their twitter-stream.

Chime:

The Chime group (which comprises of Ad Agencies - VCCP - design and PR) are shortly to open their scheme. The page should be fully functional/open in November 2011.

Dare:

Dare’s grad scheme has yet to re-open this year. However, their Facebook page (which they used to recruit last year) hints that the graduate scheme is going to open in the Autumn. Their twitter streams (both for main agency and the graduates) should provide a hint as to when it’s going to open.

DAS Accelerate:

The DAS scheme has just launched. It shuts on the 3^rd of January 2012. You can find out more about it on the DAS link above, or go straight to the application page here. Alternatively, you can check out their twitter here.

DLKW Lowe:

My old agency is looking for bright grads to come and join. You can find more details here. You’ll have to apply before midday on the 9^th of November.

Elvis:

Elvis are shortly to announce their 2011 graduate scheme. Any activity will take place on their Facebook wall, which you can see here. Applications will open in Autumn.

JWT London:

JWT's graduate scheme is happening this year - find out more here and on the Facebook page (and the twitter stream). Applications shut on the 2nd of November.

Leo Burnett:

Leo’s have just launched their new graduate scheme, called ‘The Foundry’, aimed at both account handlers and planners. You can find out more about it here. (UPDATE - THE FACEBOOK PAGE IS NOW LIVE. ). Their twitter stream is here. Applications close on Friday 28^th of October.

M&C Saatchi:

M&C’s site indicates that they are going to be recruiting graduates this year, but the link re-directs to a broken email link. They’ve recruited every year since I’ve written AdGrads, so it’s worth keeping your eyes peeled.

Ogilvy:

Ogilvy have a bumper crop of schemes that are shortly to open. They've been in touch. Both the Ogilvy Fellowship and Planning Fellowship open on the 14th of November, and will close on the 8th of January 2012. There's also a two month 'Summer Fellowship', which is going to open in early 2012. You can find out more about the Ogilvy Fellows by looking at their Facebook page, their twitter account or by looking on Youtube. Also, they are launching a competition on Monday (10th of October) for potential applicants to their open night, where top speakers from the group will be chatting. To get a place, you should write a tweet explaining why, and hashtagging it #OgilvyOpenNight.

RKCR/Y&R:

UPDATED: Rainey's grad scheme (for account management) is now live. It closes on the 28th of October.

WPP Fellowship:

WPP's 'golden ticket', 3 year, multiple country and marketing discipline scheme is now open. It shuts Thursday 10th of November at midday, GMT.

Good luck with all of these, guys. Again, let me know if I've missed any.

The Great Lottery...

A possibility.

Quite a few of you will already have had, or will be beginning to have, second round interviews. Congratulations are in order. You're past the first round stage, which is a massive achievement in itself.

And I thought it'd be a good idea to write some second round tips and tricks, whilst underlining the most important thing to take away from the whole experience.

The most important (and honest) thing to say is that it's all a bit of a lottery, really. If you've gotten this far, you'll be good enough to work in this business. You have the qualifications to prosper, you undoubtedly write well, and know what you're talking about. But the second round is ultimately like preparing for an exam. You prepare for ages, try to second guess what you'll be asked to do, but it comes down to on the day. You can think you've done incredibly well and still not get through.

Depressing? Perhaps, but it's not meant to be. You're in a situation which has many chaos elements, and i'll outline them. These points should hopefully help.

1) Other Candidates

You're surrounded by the sort of people who only have two things in common with you. Firstly, that they want a career in advertising (for the most part - some are dabbling), and secondly, that they impressed your interviewers well enough to be there. But they won't be the same as you. Oh no. Some will be loud. Some will be quiet. Many will have done vastly different degrees and have had very different experiences. I remember one of my second round interviews; one of the blokes there was a very promising acoustic guitarist, and preceded to sing a song half way through the day. Never found out if he got through.

But again, don't worry about it. What you can learn from the other candidates is a little about the sort of people the agency is looking for. Do you think everyone else in the room is a bit of a ball-breaker? Well, that might tell you a little bit about the agency's culture. Maybe they like the sort of people who'd sell their own grandmothers to make an ad. Or, are they all the sort of people who've taken up knitting at 22? Again, it'll help you learn what the agency wants. And this is useful when trying to understand whether you'd fit in - because, God knows, this is just as much about you as it is the place. There's nothing worse than forcing yourself to like a place and hating it from the outset.

2) The Tasks

Hopefully, this won't be like The Apprentice. But if it is, don't panic; again, it tells you something about the sort of place you might work at. I remember being asked at one agency to try and make something (out of selected materials) to stop an egg from smashing. Wacky, a bit mad, but interesting.

Now, this might seem very trivial, much like some of the more spurious and odd questions you were asked in round one. And it can piss some people off. I mean, who gives a flying fuck about keeping an egg alive? Well, there are two points to this. One is the crux of the matter - there's always a question behind this sort of thing. Why, in God's name, would you be asked about something like that? It's really to see how you react and how you think. It's a lateral thinking exercise; only in this instance, you're in a room full of people who're keeping an eye on you, and assessing your response and how you work with others.

Throwing your arms up in the arm and saying 'it's fucked', while possibly the correct response if this was an everyday situation, won't endear you to your team or the people having a look at you. That said, being entirely po-faced about the situation isn't realistic either. Having a chuckle and a laugh with the people who're in your team is the right sort of response. The second (but no less important) point is that you get asked all sorts of strange things in advertising. Things that make you wonder why you need a degree to have gotten onto the grad scheme, that your client is potentially nuts, and that bond you and your team together. That's just advertising, and the second round tasks are the start of realising that.

3) The Presentation

I'm not going to go as far as saying 'it's like a pitch', because you usually have something ressembling a series of facts to go from in a pitch. But, it is just as much a 'on the day' thing as a pitch. That really confident, brassy Brummie girl, who claimed to love presenting? Her freezing on the spot might happen, and often does. That quiet Swedish bloke? He'll come up with the goods when it looked like a stiff breeze might blow him over.

Don't rely, or expect the presentation to go as planned. Also, those people who 'win' the presentation don't always get jobs. It'll be a combination of how you work with your team, and what you've contributed to the whole day. There won't be one moment where you think you've suddenly cracked it. You never truly know. You can have an idea of just what the individual judges are after (based on their job role - the planner will be interested in the sort of insights you've come up with, the account handler will want to know how you promise to deliver it, and how it'll work moving forward), but there's always room for someone to charm the room with a captivating presentation.

4) Your Judges

Already alluded to in point three, the people popping in to see you are a funny bunch. You can't really second guess them. Is asking for help, or for their opinion a good thing? Do they expect you to be self-sufficient? (Well, in truth, nobody expects you to do it on your own, so don't be afraid to ask them what they think).

And that friendly planner who's been giving you advice all day? He may just turn into an absolute bastard when assessing your presentation, just to see how you react. And what of agency management, who (if my experiences are reliable) swan in towards the end of the day - not having been able to give up the whole day - and decide just who they like during the presentations? What's worse...they have the ability to overrule people who have spent the whole day with you. The best won't, mind.

How the whole bunch are with you will give you an insight into that mysterious thing, 'agency culture' too. No matter how friendly, shiny or spangly the website or rumour about them in Campaign might seem, this is where you begin to have an idea about them. Would you, in truth, like to work for them? Respect is key in this situation. Sure, you want a job in advertising; you don't want to work for a bunch of fuckwits who mistreat you and have egos the size of small planets. Don't go in with those kind of preconceptions. People are those who make agencies - they may once, for example, have been a great agency, but the people you meet on the day are those partially responsible for improving it and winning business. Do you trust them to help train you and make you better?

Some Final Words...

If rumour is to be believed, Sorrell, Bullmore and Steel (the owner, ex-JWT ECD/Chairman and WPP special consultant and the man who runs the WPP Fellowship) were all rejected by JWT on their graduate recruitment scheme. One now owns the entire network, the other was Chairman, the last is still called upon by JWT to help with pitches.

Personally, I was rejected by Lowe when I applied for a graduate job with them in 2005. I've just finished two happy years there. Being rejected from the graduate scheme doesn't mean you can never work in a place, or ever work in advertising. Sure, it's hard to take when you're used to achieving academically - but that's real life, i'm afraid. Keep trying, and you'll get in. Grad schemes aren't always the way in. Getting in is by far the hardest thing to do though.

If you're one of the lucky few who got through; congratulations. It'll be a helluva ride.

Two other grad schemes...

Another good thing with 'two' in the title.

Short but sweet, this 'un.

Rainey Kelly Campbell Roalfe/Y&R and Clemmow Hornby Inge have opened their grad schemes. Sorry for not picking them up sooner.

Rainey Kellys' deadline is the 29th of November.

CHI's is the 27th of November.

Best of luck guys and gals.

More Grad Scheming...

I can safely say you won't be working for him.

Following on from the seemingly exhaustive list of grad schemes we posted a little while ago, there are even more that've opened.

The Cossette lot have opened. So this means:

Dare Digital have opened, deadline's the 15th of November.

MCBD have opened. Get your apps in, also by the 15th of November.

I'm not sure about Elvis - couldn't find anything. Anyone from Elvis want to confirm?

If there are any more we've missed, give us a shout. Ogilvy & McCann still haven't opened.